Welcome back Grocker!

I love the idea of these thread videos, talking about how things are going, more of a general update rather than just a playing video, I might think about doing that for mine!

Side note: when it's folded round to you sb vs bb, you don't need to open 3x, 2.5 or just 2x is fine, they do the same job but costs you less

Would also be good to see you pop up a bit more in the pokertube whatsapp group, can link to your videos as well, stick some hands in there etc

Good luck!

Hey man thanks for saying hi!

I'll do my best to be more active there. Just not been playing a lot over the past few months. Have posted a few things though lately.

The SB thing you mentioned. I prefer a 3x because IP people just call almost anything to a 2x raise. I know I call a LOT wider when people 2x to me rather than 3x. It depends on what range you use also and potentially player type. But that specifically seems to have been mentioned by a couple of coaches that less than 3x just gives too much ease for the BB to play better IP. It works for me anyway but I'm always open for changes if I see a clear benefit.

I may get a bit more time playing in the next couple of weeks as my girlfriend has gone away and I normally spend a fair bit of the week at her house. Good thing she likes to play too though. I'm a bit lucky in that respect haha.

Main thing is I just wanna stay involved with the game and the people I've met around it. Gonna have a good time for sure!

Hi there sir, nice to see you getting back into the groove.
I too have hardly played most of the last 6 months, mainly due to br being around $8-$20 for the whole duration of that period. Got it up to around 180 now so deposited it onto another site and getting back to it now.

I found the thing is with SB v BB is that a 2x raise does get, sometimes, any two will do to call (I'll fold nothing to a 2x, lol) . Thing is they didn't improve postflop so it's all good by me and regs gonna reg whatever. I use 2.5x but people are going to call or fold if they like at these limits anyway.

So hi anyway and have fun smacking those nl4 guys around!

Hey Mal, nice to see you here!

Yeah maybe the upside to the 2x is they people call so loose that they don't want to continue much to many flop bets. But then the problem is that their range is wider on hard to read flops and you're OOP, so cbetting more won't justify it too much. I think the advantage goes in their hands too much. I'm officially moving to NL4 at 30 buyins. So far I have 29.5 buyins lol. Let's hope the next session goes ok.

Also @Pwll Hope it goes well for you too!

You still on Party? I'd suggest a look at Microgaming, the games are soft these days.

Nope, just withdrew and moved to Betfair yesterday. The games on Party were a nitregfest most times, so boring, but they did have a decent pool of fastforward going; Betfair doesn't! For comparison, FF had say 170-250 seats, even if they were multitabling regs, whereas Betfair had 24 at the same time of day. Swings and roundabouts, the pool on the latter seem softer by and large.

Now I'm back with a playable roll I'll tidy my game up a bit and looking to move to nl10 nosebleeds by January - with some rungood obviously - ...

Laters.

Gl Mal and hope you run good at the NL10 which it looks like you might already be taking shots at.

Today I'm going to talk about a niche scenario. It's about 3bet pots with AJo in a specific spot.
I think people have an automatic idea of what to do on the flop without really looking into it, it'll also apply to some other A High hands.
See what you think by watching the video below!

I'd like to know your thoughts. @fergrberger@fawltyfelix@Scrubx

So firstly, you are stating things like "pretty much every hand in his range is going to call here" but that goes back to YOUR assumption about his range, which you can't verify is what is actually going on, right? So for instance you don't give villain any of the middlingish SCs like 78s 98s - you also don't really give him hands like A8s A9s which also might be in there depending on villain and games.

For example on Stars the general 3bet sucess rate is fairly low, meaning calling ranges vs 3bets will be rather wide still, while on party poker it's the other way around, so I wanted to start with that, basically pointing out that you just can't take your range-construction for the truth, but I guess that should overall be quite logical.

So the next part about it is, generally the Q high boards are better for the defender than the 3better, while the K high boards are better for the 3better, which you also pointed out, so generally we shouldn't do more cbetting on the K53r than the Q53r quite naturally.

You state "we want a board where we will get a lot of folds on if we are betting small, right?" - No that's actually not true, it helps if we have a board where we will get a lot of folds BUT the point of the small bet is, that we don't need to see a fold that often.

As a general thing, people won't hit their MDFs on any sort of board vs 1/3 cbets, and there is more to it than just wanting to take it down, there is equity denial and equity realization to think about aswell.

If you decide to check back the flop, which is totally ok, you should not look to barrel a ton when checked to again, since after checking the flop back people generally won't give you a ton of credit, that being said there are certain obvious turns like the King, if he checks on that we can easily barrel him off a ton of hands. (as you also mentioned later on).

You also said that we would check back on a jack turn or at least you said "probably", I disagree if he checks towards us on the Jack turn we can def. go for value, since he will be leading most of his QX at this point we are good to go for some value.


Generally to sum this up:

You are def. right about some things, but you have been assumptive and wrong about other things.

And as said the Q high board is generally not that good vs a guy that called a 3bet for us as the 3better. But if you e.g. change the queen to a King or a Ten we have a pretty clear cut cbet 1/3 spot, and even on the Q-high boards it's going to be hard for a 1/3 cbet to be bad.
It doesn't have to work a lot of the time, you get quite good equity realization and you deny him from bluffing you if he has a worse hand and you deny him from realizing his equity.

It's also not always just about your equity vs his range, right? There are more facts to consider, but I'm sure you generally know that.

Anyways there you have my thoughts on it hehe hope I could help in any form or fashion.

I think @Scrubx hit most of the points really well. I think the points he makes about the 1/3 cbet are really important. MDF is 75% and in most cases people won't defend that as they will need to be defending stuff that looks really weak to them. Now you could be right in your case that they will defend 100% of that range versus even half pot. Idk, but i do think the range is a bit tight. I think people will defend more than that versus a 3b from the BU.

I think the another point that was missed about the 1/3 is, that in cases like your AJ, it could be considered thin value. Lets say they have more Ax suited than what you have like some of the A9s or A8s or some of the wheel Aces. So you bet 1/3 and now because of the small bet lets say they try and defend more of their range and they opt to start calling all the Axs with BDFD and maybe something like JTs that has full BDSD and a BDFD. These are hands that he probably should be defending vs a 1/3 bet. Well now your Ahigh with J kicker is getting "thin" value from those hands.

Scrub mentioned the equity denial and realization as well. Not sure it was explained but you need to think of it like those block bets you do. You are setting the price on the flop and for 1/3 on flop getting to see the river. You can check back a lot of turns and see the river and realize your equity fairly cheaply or if turn brings cards that are good for bluffing or for value you can continue. This only doesn't work versus some one who will call on the flop than donk turns and put you in really tough spots.

Last thing I want to add is I think you first need to think about what kind of strategy you want to use in spots like this (3bp IP as aggressor). Do you want to implore a 1/3 cbet with almost all your range or do you want to go more traditional route and bet 1/2 or 2/3 and split your range into bets and check backs and the checkbacks into calls, fold, and raises on the turn vs a bet. Once you figure that out I think it is better to put your entire range into equilab versus their range and start constructing your range and see where AJo falls. Its good to see the equity but I think it is better to think about our entire range in a spot and where we think a specific hand falls in our range.

Hey @Scrubx and @fawltyfelix . Thanks for getting involved with the chat here! This is what I like to see

Yes I make some assumptions, but it's mainly to set a baseline to work around, I also did mention I see a lot of people calling wider, but some also tighter. The truth is many regs are probably defending much wider than I do, I think people have taken it a little far but then I have to compile a base range to talk about. I did specify (or I hope I did) that I was focusing on regs who mostly have some sort of plan as to what they continue with or don't. Do you think it's normal these days to see 78s continue OOP vs BTn from MP? Well maybe for some but not for others. I am making a basic middle ground line to work from. Maybe it's too tight but it's useful to have a "control" range based on what ranges you may use yourself.

Yes I am familiar with the fact we don't need our bet to work often if we use 1/3 sizing, but we have to have a plan as to what cards we want to barrel or not barrel on otherwise it's kind of like clicking buttons if we expect a lot of calls without knowing which turns are good and which aren't and why. And that's part of what I was getting into. And thanks @Scrubx for putting in your 2 cents about that. I chose this spot because by nature it's something that can be unclear. I'm not as fond as some with the 1/3 that is used all around for most of your range. Although I use it in some other spots mostly to exploit. It seems something that is more common now though. I just don't think it works too well as equity denial. I find it a little easier to balance by betting a bit larger but less of time (not a lot larger though), and using more checks with some A strong highs and some crushing hands. We're not always going to get bluffed off of a turn anyway because we shouldn't always be folding certain turns, which again gets into which turns are good and bad and why.

I think it's a mixture of different coaches views, and I feel there's a few newer concepts which are being highlighted by you two here that aren't being used by others but both make sense. Though you do have to move with the times if new concepts are working better for today's game.

I'm a little rusty on a few things lately, that's for sure.

I'd actually like to hear @mingthemerciless93 view on this but I don't know how much he hangs around here.

Welcome back @Grocker6! Amazing strategic discussion and I might add my two cents to it later (though I'm pretty sure I can't really improve on what @fawltyfelix and @Scrubx posted above) but I'd like to go back to the first post in this thread. The longer I live on this strange whirling globe the more I realize that a long-term success in any field can only come from the place of balance, at least when you define success as something more than the amount of money in your bank account. I'm sure it's possible to live a degen poker and/or big company CEO lifestyle and make tons of money that way but unless you're a sociopath in a true sense of the word, that experience will eventually leave you hollow. Same goes for one's hobbies and side-projects, it's so easy to burn out when you don't have a strong structure behind them. I'm glad to hear that you managed to find your balance and I'm sure it will help you tremendously in your poker journey.

Thanks @MattVIP !

Yeah, I'm glad I've found more balance. It helps having other things to do.
As I mentioned I do work too and I'm interested in a lot of other things that I enjoy, but I can obsess over getting good at stuff. I just try to chill a bit more these days and have fun with life in general.

Anyway as for the BR, took a hit the last couple of days. Ran like dog poo with the all ins and bad bad beats. And just had a lot of tough spots all at once.
Maybe could have made a couple of folds, but at the time when I was thinking the spots through, I thought they were ok, just shows how much people hate to bluff at these micros. They just show the big hands, even when the board is full of missed draws and a lot of other hands I beat. Or maybe just a bad period of variance.

Another thing that has caught me out a lot these last 2 days is people not fast playing their flopped sets on draw-heavy flops. I will see a river and make a flush and there's also straights and possible full house out there, but I say "well he can only really have THIS or THAT full house, but that would have raised the flop. And I also know they have straights they overplay or a lower flush", so I end up facing the FH. And it's happened a few times. Just annoying that I'm using logic to help my decisions and it has backfired so often. Yet previous to the last 2 days I couldn't go wrong. You always ask yourself... what's changed? Feels like there's a big red [VARIANCE] button and someone pushed it and everything turns around haha.

It's just weird how you can got from a 50BI upswing to suddenly losing about 13BI all at once and feeling like you can't win a hand. Just poker I guess.

Bankroll started at 30e, up to 145e and now back down to 108e. So I'm taking a little study time the next couple of days and won't play much.

TBH I don't feel like I'm that good of a player right now, maybe it's the last couple of days but I started feeling uncomfortable with too many spots and have too many questions. I hate being unsure about spots. I feel like I may as well throw my money in the bin if I don't know what to do, so I'll put my heart into making myself better. At least I'm using good BR management.

All this being said. I'm feeling good and gonna turn it back around. I have a free day today to enjoy

Seeya later all.

Hey again everyone!

Had a session today, went better than some of the recent ones even with a cooler stuck in the middle.
Ended up a couple of buyins or so. I ran ok in some spots when I was ahead.
Some randomers punting off stuff like A8s vs my AK and I held.

Getting ready to go grab some food so I'm set for work in a bit.

Wish I was grinding up the 4nl ladder, but I'm sticking to what I should be. I like the idea of turning the 30e into something good.

A couple of notable hands here...


I actually held up in a spot like this today! Not been happening much but here we are.






This turn was just amazing right? Guy check-raised me to almost all my stack. Not a set up pot at all right...





Right, I'm hungry. Gotta go get a present for my mum's birthday as well today.

Seeya later all!

Haven't been able to play much today. I'm off to a jam night now.
And no it doesn't involve jam sandwiches or anything to do with food.
Maybe a few drinks are involved though. Basically musicians from around the area come together and get up on stage with a house band or with whoever and play songs and have a good old social time. The better half is part of the house band but she's in Aussie land at the moment so someone is taking her place to drum. Been a while since I been due to work.But looking forward to playing a few songs and a few games of pool too.

Anyway the last sessions or two have been ok. Nearly back to 4nl. By a few cents worth.
BR is slowly climbing at 119.53e.

Here's a hand in response to the last hand picture I posted.

Decent flop I'd say...

Heh last 2 images show you on both sides of the set-over-set cooler!

You seem to eat a lot as well

I suppose you 'jammed' it then? Sigh, sorry .. al get ma coat ...

Hey all.

It's been a fun day. Watched a band play and met up with some friends. Had a good laugh.

It's been nice, a bit of a drink and catch up is always good. Especially mixed with music.

I've played a few sessions. The 4nl sessions have been a little flat, been mixing in the shitty stakes too but hey.

Chilling at 137.89e. Not much to say really. Got a couple of hands to post

This guy plays so weird and I thought I had him for once, this was what happened...





Do you think this flop was ok enough to get value here after a sneaky 3bet and hit from SB?





Anyway, I've gotta get some sleep now. Seeya later all!

I usually 3bet

Seems my post went awry.

I meant I often 3bet 7s or less but without the flopmeaister being that generous. Nice job!